Black Pouch Chewies: Shedding a bit more light on the Dark Matter :)

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Black Pouch Chewies: Shedding a bit more light on the Dark Matter :)

Post by Dr Dengar on Sat May 21, 2016 1:59 pm

Last summer Kenneth visited me and we spent a great weekend going through loose figures, sharing knowledge, and discussing the more difficult variants, especially Poch (or “early PBP”). Below a "Work in Progress" pic. Very Happy

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One figure which puzzled us a bit at that time was a figure which resembled a Poch “black pouch” Chewie very much. I obtained the figure in 2010 and though it resembles his Poch brothers very much (including a very dark pouch), we then concluded that it is definitely a Kenner figure on close examination. Today I stumbles again upon this figure, and decided to make some pics with his Poch brothers, and share my thoughts about them. I am anxious to know what you think.

In the comparison shots below you see three Chewies each time. All of them have a Hong Kong COO, COO family I according to [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.].

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From left to right we see.

Figure 1: Kenner (left figure)

  • Eyes: Pale greyish blue pupils on white
  • Teeth: White
  • Bandolier: White
  • Pouch: Brownish black, a bit glossy


Figure 2 Poch (middle figure)

  • Eyes: Strong blue colored pupils on brilliant white
  • Teeth: Brilliant white
  • Bandolier: Brilliant white
  • Poch: Pure black, dull


Figure 3 Poch (right figure)

  • Eyes: Pale greyish blue pupils on white
  • Teeth: White
  • Bandolier: White
  • Pouch: Pure black, dull


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Figures 2 and 3 came from Spain, and both have the same type of pure black pouches, in contrast to figure 1 having a brownish black pouch. To me that is a tell sign that both figures 2 and 3 are Poch.

Still upon close examination figures 2 and 3 seem to differ from each other. Compared to the right figure, the eyes of the middle figure are painted in a much stronger blue, and the white paint used for the eyes, teeth and bandolier is brighter (brilliant white). Admittedly, these subtle differences are easy to see when having the figures in hand but are difficult to grasp by camara. In fact, the brilliant white in figure 2 looks the same as used for the Poch AT AT Driver (shoulders), Poch FX-7 (tentacle arm), and some Poch Ben Kenobi figures (hair). To me that is a strong indication that the head/torso part of figure 2 was painted in the PBP factory. In contrast to figure 3 where the head/torso part seems to be a 100% match with the Kenner figure on the left.

It is therefore safe to assume that Figure 2 is a Class I ("Pure Poch") figure and Figure 3 is a Class II ("Hybrid") figure composed of PBP Painted and Kenner parts. Please click the link below where I explain the concept of Class I and II figures in a bit more detail.  
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My thoughts based upon this (please challenge, other opinions are very welcome)

  1. Not every Chewie with a dark pouch is a Poch figure. Kenner also released them.
  2. However only Poch Chewies have the pure black pouches. From photographs alone it is hard to distinguish between brownish black (Kenner) and pure black (Poch). So Poch collectors be aware and only buy from Spanish sources or trusted collectors who know their stuff and can make the comparison for you.
  3. The black pouch Poch Chewie came in two flavours. A pure Poch figure (Class I figure) and a hybrid figure which was assembled from PBP painted parts (leg with painted black pouch) and Kenner painted parts (head/torso with pale greyish blue pupils).
  4. I can even imagine there is also a Class II Poch figure having the PBP painted head/torso (with brilliant white) and the Kenner painted brownish black (NOT pure black!) pouch.



Note: There is also a second type op Poch Chewie. It has  a Hong Kong COO from Family 3 (Tantive Guide). It was made from parts that probably originated from Kader Industries, as the limbs have a strong tendency to discoulour/transform from brown to green). The paint apps on this figure are unique to early PBP production. The pouch is painted in purplish brown (a bit like egg plant), and brilliant white was used for the bandolier, teeth and eyes. The blue paint used for the is unique as well. But more about that figure some other time. Let’s first start a discussion on the black pouch Wookiee. Very Happy


Thank you for your time.
I am really looking forward to your thoughts now.

Marco
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Re: Black Pouch Chewies: Shedding a bit more light on the Dark Matter :)

Post by chris.75 on Sat May 21, 2016 10:04 pm

a very interesting and informative thread marco, thanks for posting it buddy clapping

I was wondering if it is possible to distinguish any differences in the type of spray mask, used for the top of the pouch (where the hair overlaps).
To help identify a difference between a Poch painted and a Kenner painted pouch?
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Re: Black Pouch Chewies: Shedding a bit more light on the Dark Matter :)

Post by hellhippie on Sun May 22, 2016 12:06 pm

I have both these poch variants Marco , black pouch and eggplant pouch green limbs . your comments on the black pouch are very informative , i'll post some pictures of mine later but as you've stated its extremely hard to photograph the differences . I do remember my black pouch having VERY stiff limbs as well almost impossible to move as the figure wasn't put together correctly in the factory . the limbs aren't locked like pbp later figures become but it is an interesting trait for my example . the brilliant white paint really pops on Chewbacca
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Re: Black Pouch Chewies: Shedding a bit more light on the Dark Matter :)

Post by Chancellor_Peter on Wed May 25, 2016 8:00 am

Black pouches! So they exist after all. Wow learnt something new today. yay
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Re: Black Pouch Chewies: Shedding a bit more light on the Dark Matter :)

Post by hellhippie on Fri May 27, 2016 1:56 pm

heres my 2 poch Chewbaccas , I don't have their kenner counterpart although I have heard of one . funny what people consider poch nowadays .....
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Re: Black Pouch Chewies: Shedding a bit more light on the Dark Matter :)

Post by Nico on Fri May 27, 2016 4:38 pm

Never tire of seeing your POCH figures Bill, they are great mate cheers
You have put together a really nice collection of hard to get figures clapping
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Re: Black Pouch Chewies: Shedding a bit more light on the Dark Matter :)

Post by hellhippie on Fri May 27, 2016 7:12 pm

thanks Andy , im gonna take pics of my poch collection very soon for a small limelight . cheers

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Re: Black Pouch Chewies: Shedding a bit more light on the Dark Matter :)

Post by Dr Dengar on Sun May 29, 2016 12:22 pm

Thanks for all your input, guys.Very Happy

Nice Poch Chewies, Bill! cheers

I have just compared my Poch black Chewies with another Kenner counterpart and to be honest, I am not sure whether the bandolier paint is unique for this Poch variant (unlike the bandolier of the second Poch variant which seems very white). Maybe only the black pouch is unique, the remainder of the figure is always Kenner?
Never a dull momemt when researching Poch figures. Very Happy

I will make some comparison shots next weekend, when the weather is a bit better, I hope.

Cheers
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Re: Black Pouch Chewies: Shedding a bit more light on the Dark Matter :)

Post by Lt BrennTantor on Sun May 29, 2016 5:14 pm

I combined all the guides that I was able to find about all the variations that can help you identified if your Chewbacca it's a POCH  or PBP figure Wink. Here is a link with loose figures with larger pictures: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

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The first 12 figures where not produced in the same way as most of the figures that followed, at least in terms of sculpt differences for the COO families. Many had numerous families that all look almost, if not identical. Chewbacca is one such example, the overall torso sculpt appears identical on all families. There is one minor detail on the end of the left hand however that does appear different on all families, it is not the best means of identification by far, but it's about as good as it gets unfortunately.

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Re: Black Pouch Chewies: Shedding a bit more light on the Dark Matter :)

Post by 4-Paul on Sun May 29, 2016 6:28 pm

Hello everyone.

Here I have some photos of a supposed Chewe Poch black bag.

The alleged Poch is right.

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Re: Black Pouch Chewies: Shedding a bit more light on the Dark Matter :)

Post by 4-Paul on Sun May 29, 2016 6:32 pm

In this photo there are six Chewed Coo MIHK, the course poch is the fourth from the left.

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Re: Black Pouch Chewies: Shedding a bit more light on the Dark Matter :)

Post by 4-Paul on Sun May 29, 2016 6:34 pm

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Poch alleged right.

Compared to a COO MIHK Kenner

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Re: Black Pouch Chewies: Shedding a bit more light on the Dark Matter :)

Post by 4-Paul on Sun May 29, 2016 6:37 pm

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Here is his sister PBP, the bag is glossy dark brown.
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Re: Black Pouch Chewies: Shedding a bit more light on the Dark Matter :)

Post by 4-Paul on Sun May 29, 2016 6:39 pm

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Another view with her sister Kenner.

Thank you very much to all and greetings.
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Re: Black Pouch Chewies: Shedding a bit more light on the Dark Matter :)

Post by Commander Clint on Sun May 29, 2016 6:53 pm

welcome

Thanks 4-Paul for posting pictures of your Chewy's. cheers
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Re: Black Pouch Chewies: Shedding a bit more light on the Dark Matter :)

Post by 4-Paul on Sun May 29, 2016 7:34 pm

Thank you very much friend!!

Thank you for allowing me to participate bowwing
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Re: Black Pouch Chewies: Shedding a bit more light on the Dark Matter :)

Post by Nico on Sun May 29, 2016 7:39 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:Thank you very much friend!!

Thank you for allowing me to participate bowwing
As Clint said, Welcome to Tantive 4-Paul welcome It's great you have posted pictures of your chewies here mate cheers
Cheers Andy afro
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Re: Black Pouch Chewies: Shedding a bit more light on the Dark Matter :)

Post by 4-Paul on Sun May 29, 2016 7:54 pm

Clint thank you very much !!

It is a pleasure to meet you.
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Re: Black Pouch Chewies: Shedding a bit more light on the Dark Matter :)

Post by Commander Clint on Sun May 29, 2016 8:02 pm

4-Paul, if you have a few minutes to introduce your self, that would be great. cheers

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Re: Black Pouch Chewies: Shedding a bit more light on the Dark Matter :)

Post by hellhippie on Sun May 29, 2016 8:24 pm

great pictures and thanks for the sharing 4 paul and welcome

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Re: Black Pouch Chewies: Shedding a bit more light on the Dark Matter :)

Post by chris.75 on Sun May 29, 2016 8:30 pm

Hey Pablo, thanks for chiming in on this post buddy cheers
Having now seen comparison pics of your alleged black pouch Chewie, against your kenner and PBP counterparts, I am definitely more convinced that it is indeed a black pouch Poch variant.
You were right to keep this one in your collection my friend, even if it meant that i couldn't buy it from you Smile
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Re: Black Pouch Chewies: Shedding a bit more light on the Dark Matter :)

Post by 4-Paul on Sun May 29, 2016 9:22 pm

Thank you very much Chris!!

This weekend has been very hard for me and your opinion about my Chewbacca gives me great joy.

Thank you very much for your help friend! Smile
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Re: Black Pouch Chewies: Shedding a bit more light on the Dark Matter :)

Post by chris.75 on Sun May 29, 2016 9:30 pm

you are most welcome my friend Smile
My thoughts are with you and your family at this troubling time.
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Re: Black Pouch Chewies: Shedding a bit more light on the Dark Matter :)

Post by 4-Paul on Sun May 29, 2016 10:33 pm

Thank you very much also to Andy and Bill for their welcome.
cheers
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Re: Black Pouch Chewies: Shedding a bit more light on the Dark Matter :)

Post by CorporateSlave on Wed Jun 08, 2016 2:08 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] wrote:I combined all the guides that I was able to find about all the variations that can help you identified if your Chewbacca it's a POCH  or PBP figure Wink. Here is a link with loose figures with larger pictures: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

What no Glasslite or Top Toys?  Wink

(Glasslite looks to me like the COO 13 variant, Top Toys seems to be its own unique brand of train wreck...)
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